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Where do unsold Newstand Editions go? Options
monidaw1
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 7:21:03 AM

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Quote:
No,you are. The "bulk" listing only stands as long as the two types aren't broken out. As soon as you list one as a variant (newsstand) the other (direct) becomes the main issue.


Not UNLESS something is added to the original listing that identifies it as Direct or any other Caption distinguisher. It really is that simple. You don't have to reinvent the wheel.

Quote:
I have only had a request to look for newsstand editions twice in 5 years on the site and I did both times, resulting in one sale. I will continue to check for anyone who asks. Supplying customer service and completely re-working my store are two different things.


This is the computer age. If it's not visibly offered for sale, many people just keep on clicking to the next link in their list until they find someone like Denver willing to have what they want without all the extra run around and delays in searching, messaging, etc. Things change over time. 5 years ago I didn't even want a comic book. Last year I couldn't care less about a single distinction in any cover only caring about having the inside to read. Now I've learned enough to know there is a valid distinction between the types, a valid reason for some of them to be rarer and command higher prices like the high grade 80's and the newer one's now having unsold copys having their covers cut off making them scarce. This can really be a simple thing. Until you try it you don't know what may happen you're only guessing. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that if the largest comic book retailer on the planet thinks there's enough interest to make it worth the trouble to list a few (notice they don't include all of them yet either) that having a few small retailers doing what they do isn't going to hurt you. In fact if you're truley thinking they're not worth it then use the listings to load some of yours up at 50 cent and just undercut them so bad they have no financial reason to keep offering them while passing on a bargin to the people that want them. you don't make change by ignoring something, you make change by taking action.

Bamf!!! Photobucket Pages

monidaw1
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 7:28:05 AM

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Have any of these? I'm trying to find them in Newsstand editions for someone now.


Amazing Fantasy (v2) - 1, 8

Amazing Spider-Man (v2) - 13, 24, Annual 37

Amazing Spider-Man Extra - 2

Archie's Weird Mysteries - 15

Avengers Classic - 1

Bishop the Last X-Man - 8

Black Panther (v3) - 2

Cable & Deadpool - 1, 11, 15, 17, 23

Captain Marvel (v4) - 27, 28, 29, 30

Captain Marvel (v5) - 9/44, 11/46, 18/53, 25/60

ClanDestine - 6, 7

Daredevil (v2) - 3, 11

Dark Reign Fantastic Four - 2

Darkhawk - 39, 50, Annual 3

Deadpool (v1) - 11, 39, 40, 49, 67, 69

Deathlok (v2) - 1, 4, 5, 7, 8, 9, 10

Doctor Strange (v3) - 55, 61, 65, 67

Doom 2099 - 15, 17, 29, 33, 39

Elektra - 7, 13

Emma Frost - 14

Excalibur (v1) - 46, 51, 125

Excalibur (v2) - 1

Exiles (v1) - 2, 23, 26, 34, 43, 44

Fantastic Four (v1) - Annual 1998

Fantastic Four (v2) - 49/478

Fantastic Four Unlimited - 7

Felicia Hardy Black Cat - 4

Generation X - 68

Ghost Rider (v2) - Annual 2

Ghost Rider 2099 - 7

Ghost Rider Blaze Spirits of Vengeance - 19

Giant-Size Amazing Spider-Man - 1

Giant-Sized Spider-Man - 1

Guardians of the Galaxy (v1) - 48, 54, Annual 4

Human Torch (v2) - 2

Incredible Hulk (v2) - 111

Iron Man (v3) - 60/405, 72/417

Journey Into Mystery - 506, 622

Ka-Zar (v3) - 8, 16

Kingpin - 1, 2

Marvel Adventures Spider-Man - 26, 36

Marvel Adventures Super Heroes (v2) - 15, 16

Marvel Age - 92, 93, 94, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 105, 106, 107, 108, 109, 110, 111, 112, 113, 128, 135, 136, 137, 138, 140

Marvel Age Spider-Man - 9

Marvel Comics Presents - 175

Marvel Heroes & Legends - 1

Marvel Knights 4 - 1, 2, 10, 13

Marvel Saga - 22, 23, 25

Marvels - 1, 3

Marvels Comics Spider-Man - 1

Marvels Comics X-Men - 1

Midnight Sons Unlimited - 3

Morbius the Living Vampire - 21, 22, 23, 29

Ms. Marvel (v2) - 1, 40, 41, 42, 43, 47, 50

Muppet Babies - 10, 11

Mutant X - 32

Mystique - 11

Namor the Sub-Mariner - 50

New Mutants (v2) - 1

New Warriors (v1) - 47, 50, 53, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 69, 70, 71, Annual 4

Night Thrasher - 10, 19, 21

Nomad - 25

Peter Parker Spider-Man - 46

Power Pack - 29, 33, 34

Power Pack Holiday Special - 1

Punisher (v3) - 16, 17

Punisher (v6) - 10, 16

Punisher (v8) - 9, Annual 1

Punisher 2099 - 14, 16, 34

Punisher War Journal (v2) - 26

Punisher War Zone - 27

Quasar - 18, 22, 23, 30, 37, 38, 60

Ravage 2099 - 18

Rocko’s Modern Life - 5

Sabretooth Classics - 5

Secret Defenders - 15, 18, 25

Sensational She-Hulk - 29, 30, 37, 53

Sensational Spider-Man (v2) - Annual 1

Sentinel - 1, 2, 3

Shadows & Light - 2, 3

Silver Sable - 16, 17, 18, 24, 25, 30, 35

Silver Surfer (v2) - Annual 1998

Sleepwalker - 29, 30, 32

Spider-Girl - 29, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 68, 69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79, 80, 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 94, 99, 100

Spider-Man Classics - 15, 16

Spider-Man Clone Saga - 1, 2, 4, 5, 6

Spider-Man Doctor Octopus Out of Reach - 4, 5

Spider-Man Family - 1

Spider-Man Hobgoblin Lives - 1

Spider-Man Unlimited (v3) - 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15

Spider-Man With Great Power - 4, 5

Spider-Man’s Tangled Web - 10, 12, 16

Spider-Woman (v3) - 1, 2, 4, 5, 7, 9, 11

Super-Man/Batman - 26

Thor (v1) - 51/553, 63/565, 64/566

Thunderbolts - 8, 10, 17, 32, 33, 34, 36, 38, 56, 57, 69, 76, 80, 81, 100, 103, 120, 123, 124, 125, 137, 140, 150, Annual 1997, Annual 2000

Thunderbolts, New - 2/83, 3/84, 6/87, 7/88, 11/92, 13/94, 14/95, 15/96

Ultimate Fantastic Four - 18, Annual 1

Ultimate X-Men - 22, Annual 2

Ultimates - 5

Ultimates 2 - 11

Ultimates 3 - 4, 5

Venom Sinner Takes All - 3, 5

Warlock (v4) - 5, 6

Warlock and the Infinity Watch - 20, 28

Webspinners Tales of Spider-Man - 16, 17, 18

Wolverine (v2) - 74

Wonder Man - 24, 26, 28, 29

X-51 - 4, 12

X-Force (v1) - 98

X-Force (v3) - Annual 1

X-Man - 60, 61, 63, 65

X-Men (also called X-Men Legacy) - 209

X-Men First Class - 4

X-Men The Hidden Years - 1, 2

X-Men Unlimited (v1) - 32, 36, 40, 41, 44

X-Statix - 14

X-Treme X-Men - 35

Young Justice - 22

Bamf!!! Photobucket Pages

SwiftMann
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:06:50 AM

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monidaw1 wrote:
Not UNLESS something is added to the original listing that identifies it as Direct or any other Caption distinguisher. It really is that simple. You don't have to reinvent the wheel.

This is a database. If you differentiate one item, the perception (and reality) is that the other item is different too. The second a B variant goes in for a newsstand version, that means the A version is NOT the newsstand version. That's what it has meant for the newsstands currently in the database and any that come in down the road.

And I'd still love to see evidence that this "newsstand" thing is more than about a dozen people making up a market for this stuff. I get that things change over time, but as xylob said, the majority of collectors either want the direct edition, especially back in the Spidey-head days of UPC vs art in the box, or don't care at all.

The three of you can continue to diminish/refuse to accept the larger implications, problems and frustrations adding EVERY newsstand ever would cause (and apparently you will since this is basically the exact same thread as outcast's two from four months ago), but that won't actually change the facts - it is a bigger systematic change than the three of you realize, it will be off-putting to the super vast majority who don't care and therefore don't want to have tens of thousands of updates to their software and variants for everything in their software, it is a burden for the approvers when there are thousands of Needs Work items in the database for "real" comics to be looked at, and it's genuinely little more than a neat thing to have.

Stores that care could make a Newsstand shelf and artificially jack up the prices if they so choose. Hell, I'm giving it a try and see if anyone is dumb enough to pay, but that is requiring several hours of effort on my part and my store has less than 3,000 items.

Has DC Done Something Stupid Today?

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yourplace2
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:18:16 AM

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Jim wrote:
It goes well beyond the db schema. There would also have to be an update to the API along with the Desktop software, mobile apps, and website. It's not simple.


Did I miss something with the mobile apps?

My mobil app only has new comics on it over a 3 week period. Last week, this week, next week.

I have yet to see my phones CCL APP to do anything else but add comics from that 3 week period to my wish list.

Does the mobile app do more than this?

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monidaw1
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:32:45 AM

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X-men Classic 110

CCL has sold 5 copys in it's entire existence in VF grade or higher for a grand total of $7.87 one of those sold for as little as 45 cent.

CCL has 2 copys for sale right now for $2.59 and .99 or a combined $3.58

Denver is asking $24.40 to $33 for the Newsstand Edition of this book in VF or better.

If any one of those 5 copys had been a newsstand which we have no way of knowing and it was offered for only 25% of Denvers asking price then if it'd sold, it would have brought in more money to CCL than the sales of every other issues combined while saving the person who wanted it 75% off Denvers price.

That's the facts. If I had a newsstand copy it might be worth risking a penny to delist and relist that issue and take a chance. I'm almost scared to look and see if I was the one dumb enough to have sold the 45 cent copy not that CCL did anything to let me know that it may have been worth much much more.

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monidaw1
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:39:00 AM

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Quote:
Stores that care could make a Newsstand shelf and artificially jack up the prices if they so choose. Hell, I'm giving it a try and see if anyone is dumb enough to pay, but that is requiring several hours of effort on my part and my store has less than 3,000 items.


Why are you guessing? I've already posted lists of books I have a customer searching for right now in Newsstand Editions and I've already got sales for some of the one's I've found. Calling them "DUMB" may not be the best way to attract them over to shop with you though. Eh?

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SwiftMann
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:45:32 AM

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monidaw1 wrote:
That's the facts.

Hypotheticals aren't facts.

And, yes, I'd be willing to call anyone paying $25 for X-Men Classic #110 dumb.

Has DC Done Something Stupid Today?

"The return of beards and 90's fashion makes hipsters and homeless people impossible to tell apart." - Woody, Quantum & Woody #5
outcast
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:45:48 AM
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monidaw1 wrote:
Have any of these? I'm trying to find them in Newsstand editions for someone now.

.
.
.
Doctor Strange (v3) - 55, 61, 65, 67
.
.
.
Power Pack - 29, 33, 34
.
.
.
A whole lot of the ones you listed, I don't collect, and so I don't know anything about. I do know something about DS and PP.

Don't forget that Marvel publishes lots of comics direct-only, meaning that no newsstand edition exists. Some series started with both direct and newsstand versions, then went direct only.

Doctor Strange (v3): I assume this is Doctor Strange Sorcerer Supreme, which ran 1988–96. When I looked at this title a few months ago, it appeared to me that it had newsstand distribution for its first 50 issues, then went direct-only. I don't believe the issues you listed exist in newsstand versions.

Power Pack: I looked at this title, too, a few weeks ago, and found some really interesting things about it. It started with both direct-sales and newsstand versions, and the newsstand version always had the triple-C emblem indicating distribution by Curtis Circulation Company. It went direct-only with, I believe, #26. It resumed newsstand distribution, this time withOUT the triple-C emblem, no later than #40. I mentioned earlier in this discussion that I believe Marvel had a second newsstand distribution deal, NOT with Curtis, ca. 1990. The lack of the triple-C emblem on later newsstand copies of Power Pack suggests that it was part of the second distribution deal. I don't believe PP #s 29, 33, and 34 exist in newsstand versions.

Edit: I removed a comment about Journey into Mystery when I realized the issues were older than I first thought. I removed a comment about X-Men First Class when I realized I had confused it with First X-Men.
monidaw1
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:56:54 AM

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Quote:
Hypotheticals aren't facts.

And, yes, I'd be willing to call anyone paying $25 for X-Men Classic #110 dumb.


Those were facts you can feel free to check and you didn't call anyone paying $25 for X-Men Classic #110 dumb, you called anyone dumb enough to shop for Newsstands in your store dumb. We might want to do a little editting there.

Nerd

Quote:
A whole lot of the ones you listed, I don't collect, and so I don't know anything about. I do know something about DS, JiM, PP, and XFC.

Don't forget that Marvel publishes lots of comics direct-only, meaning that no newsstand edition exists. Some series started with both direct and newsstand versions, then went direct only.

Doctor Strange (v3): I assume this is Doctor Strange Sorcerer Supreme, which ran 1988–96. When I looked at this title a few months ago, it appeared to me that it had newsstand distribution for its first 50 issues, then went direct-only. I don't believe the issues you listed exist in newsstand versions.

Power Pack: I looked at this title, too, a few weeks ago, and found some really interesting things about it. It started with both direct-sales and newsstand versions, and the newsstand version always had the triple-C emblem indicating distribution by Curtis Circulation Company. It went direct-only with, I believe, #26. It resumed newsstand distribution, this time withOUT the triple-C emblem, no later than #40. I mentioned earlier in this discussion that I believe Marvel had a second newsstand distribution deal, NOT with Curtis, ca. 1990. The lack of the triple-C emblem on later newsstand copies of Power Pack suggest that it was part of the second distribution deal. I don't believe PP #s 29, 33, and 34 exist in newsstand versions.

Journey into Mystery 622 might still be for sale at a local bookstore, but might not be in NM condition anymore. If you would like me to check for it, let me know.

X-Men First Class is getting newsstand distribution. I don't think I've seen #4 yet. If you would like me to get it when it appears, let me know.


It's not for me but I appreciate it. I'll PM you a link to th individual so you can converse directly and offer him any you may have or come across directly.

Bamf!!! Photobucket Pages

outcast
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:59:48 AM
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monidaw1 wrote:
X-men Classic 110

CCL has sold 5 copys in it's entire existence in VF grade or higher for a grand total of $7.87 one of those sold for as little as 45 cent.

CCL has 2 copys for sale right now for $2.59 and .99 or a combined $3.58

Denver is asking $24.40 to $33 for the Newsstand Edition of this book in VF or better.
.
.
.
I'm on your side of the newsstand/direct debate, but when it comes to Denver prices, there are some things to remember:
1) Asking ain't always getting.
2) Denver runs sales frequently, meaning that it's easy for customers to get 20–30% off listed prices just by waiting for the next sale.
3) Since Denver lists an unspecified copy and a newsstand copy (but never a specified direct-sales copy), Denver has the option of using newsstand copies to fill orders for lower-priced unspecified copies. This might make sense if he's stocked more heavily in newsstand copies for a particular issue, and doing so wouldn't interfere with his newsstand program. I personally have received a newsstand version of a comic that I ordered unspecified from Denver (and of course, I was happy to get it).
monidaw1
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 9:08:24 AM

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Quote:
1) Asking ain't always getting.
2) Denver runs sales frequently, meaning that it's easy for customers to get 20–30% off listed prices just by waiting for the next sale.


I agree but it makes a good starting point for deciding what to discount off of.

Quote:

3) Since Denver lists an unspecified copy and a newsstand copy (but never a specified direct-sales copy), Denver has the option of using newsstand copies to fill orders for lower-priced unspecified copies. This might make sense if he's stocked more heavily in newsstand copies for a particular issue, and doing so wouldn't interfere with his newsstand program. I personally have received a newsstand version of a comic that I ordered unspecified from Denver (and of course, I was happy to get it).


We already do that here for many issues by not seperating them and adding a Newsstand captioned option here does the same thing. Not captioning the original listing allows it to continue to be the bulk/direct/in a poly bag but I don't feel like scanning and submitting it seperately/whatever else is slightly different from the picture posted option.

Bamf!!! Photobucket Pages

Xylob
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 9:22:37 AM

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monidaw1 wrote:
X-men Classic 110

CCL has sold 5 copys in it's entire existence in VF grade or higher for a grand total of $7.87 one of those sold for as little as 45 cent.

CCL has 2 copys for sale right now for $2.59 and .99 or a combined $3.58

Denver is asking $24.40 to $33 for the Newsstand Edition of this book in VF or better.

If any one of those 5 copys had been a newsstand which we have no way of knowing and it was offered for only 25% of Denvers asking price then if it'd sold, it would have brought in more money to CCL than the sales of every other issues combined while saving the person who wanted it 75% off Denvers price.

That's the facts. If I had a newsstand copy it might be worth risking a penny to delist and relist that issue and take a chance. I'm almost scared to look and see if I was the one dumb enough to have sold the 45 cent copy not that CCL did anything to let me know that it may have been worth much much more.
CCL shows you how many have been sold and you will never, ever, know how many (if any) Mile High has sold at their grossly inflated price.
That's the facts.

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G.I.Joe Special Missions TPB 2
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outcast
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 9:30:43 AM
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Another thing about Denver is that some of its listings/prices are just irrational to someone who studies newsstand comics. I wrote at some length about it, here at CCL:

http://www.comiccollectorlive.com/Forum/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=37792

The thread includes two longish posts by me, one about DC comics (specifically Legion of Super-Heroes), and one about Marvel comics (specifically Doctor Strange Sorcerer Supreme).
yourplace2
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 10:10:51 AM

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comicscastle wrote:
If CCL changed their policy and allowed newsstand editions as variants they would lose money because many stores (like me) would close their store and go elsewhere. I have 45,000 books listed and I will not go back through each one to see if it's a direct sale copy or not. That is a complete waste of time. Imagine what the stores with 100,000 books listed would have to go through. I would rather spend that time listing my books on Atomic Avenue or eBay.


CASTLE, you would close your store, and go through all the time to relist on another site, but think it will take too much time to modify listings in your current store with NEWSTANDS when you find one? Why would you even think about it? Get real! Laughing



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Thundercron
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 10:22:15 AM

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Before this thread gets locked, I'll throw in my FINAL two cents:

Jim says my drop-down box idea ain't as simple as it sounds. Since I'm not a interweb/computer tech guy, I'm gonna take his word on that. So he suggested that the easiest solution to add them would be in the form of a variant (ie "B") listing. However, allowing such a thing would cause havok on a store's already-listed inventory (and yes, calling one a newsstand WILL make it automatically assumed that the other is a direct edition). Plus, I don't really care for that idea anyway, because it would cause the database to look like a giant mess with the inclusion of--let's be honest--variants that most collectors don't care about. I already get a headache looking at all the Marvel UK price variants from the 70's and 80's.

So I'm guessing at this point the easiest solution would be for a store to create their own specific shelf for these. I've done so in my own store for other variants of note--Marvel 30 & 35 cent price variants, Canadian price variants, Mark Jewelers variants. And these shelves DO work, as I often have orders for multiple books that appeared on a single shelf. I probably won't add a shelf for newsstand editions, though, only because it's a little late in the game for me to start. Perhaps when I run out of my inventory to list, I will.

And Monidaw--I have some of those on your list. Including those Marvels issues. I only remember because it boggled my mind when I found them over a year ago--really, they tried to sell a comic with a $5.95 cover price at the newsstand? Can't be too many of those around...

Also, I really don't believe Marvel Age was ever distributed to the newsstand. It was a preview mag aimed at the direct outlet. I checked my stock--every single one is a direct edition. Of course, I could be wrong...
yourplace2
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 11:00:37 AM

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Apparently, the POWERS THAT BE, have already begun allowing adding NEWSTANDS as letter variants.

See WITCHBLADE & Amazing Spider-Man #583 (Obama 2nd print).

Statically speaking,not only when they ran a 2nd print on the Obama, changing the artwork, they reprinted the NEWSTAND ones as well. Is there a first print newstand Amazing Spider-Man #583?

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comicscastle
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 11:15:11 AM

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yourplace2 wrote:
comicscastle wrote:
If CCL changed their policy and allowed newsstand editions as variants they would lose money because many stores (like me) would close their store and go elsewhere. I have 45,000 books listed and I will not go back through each one to see if it's a direct sale copy or not. That is a complete waste of time. Imagine what the stores with 100,000 books listed would have to go through. I would rather spend that time listing my books on Atomic Avenue or eBay.


CASTLE, you would close your store, and go through all the time to relist on another site, but think it will take too much time to modify listings in your current store with NEWSTANDS when you find one? Why would you even think about it? Get real! Laughing

Moving to another site would be easy. i would just print a report of what I currently have for sale and transfer it to a new site. I would never have to touch a single book.



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SwiftMann
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 11:44:29 AM

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yourplace2 wrote:
Apparently, the POWERS THAT BE, have already begun allowing adding NEWSTANDS as letter variants.

Newsstand editions that have a) a different U.S. price and/or b) different cover art and/or c) different story content and/or d) different page quality have ALWAYS been allowed as letter variants.

Has DC Done Something Stupid Today?

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outcast
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 12:35:23 PM
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Thundercron wrote:
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Also, I really don't believe Marvel Age was ever distributed to the newsstand. It was a preview mag aimed at the direct outlet. I checked my stock--every single one is a direct edition. Of course, I could be wrong...
My research suggests that, although Marvel Age was initially a direct-only publication, some later issues were probably also distributed via newsstand. My basis for saying this is that the top-page edges on later issues have the color code that told newsstand stockers when to rotate comics out of stock (this color code generally didn't appear on direct-only titles). I believe some of these same issues have a blank spot on the cover of the direct-sales versions where a UPC barcode would fit. Also, there was a later Marvel Age title that was an actual comic book; I'm not certain, but it may also have had newsstand distribution.
monidaw1
Posted: Friday, December 07, 2012 2:54:39 PM

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I'll go double check the Marvel Age in a minute. I'm wondering if whoever stocked the spin racks carried both DC and Marvel to the store and ended up with DC cutting way back on Newsstand Editions at the same time. I was just uploading books today and let's look at a few results.

Justice League Europe from around 1988, issue #1 I had 7 Direct's and only 1 Newsstand, #2 I had 5 Directs and only 1 Newstand. The rest of the stack (around 60 books and annuals) had about 3 newsstands. Moving down the road of time a bit, Justice League Spectacular I had 13 A and B copys to load and none were newsstands. I checked the 6 copys I already had loaded and none of those were either. The only one I can say I ever saw for sure was the cover that was accidently loaded here for the B variant although none of mine are the newsstand B's. Not a single Justice league Task Force has a newsstand issue either and that's a little later title.

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