CCL Messageboard

It's been a while since I purchased stuff online. Now I remember why.

GEEZ....where from? Ebay? Here?

Here
I placed 3 orders the same day, 2 of them illegally shipped Media Mail, this one taking 13 days to arrive weighed only 10.6 ounces counting packing material and could have gone First Class having less time to get damaged but that option wasn't made available for checkout.

Now the waiting game begins to see how long it takes the seller to respond and what occurs when they do.

Bad shipping. Sent out in one of those thin little stiff mailers without taking the time to tape the books to an oversized piece of thick cardboard so the comics remained in the center of the mailer.



Heard back faster than I expected for CCL. $3 off to keep damaged needlessly crap that can't be resold for enough to recover the cost even with the $3 off or send them back. I'm waiting to hear back if he's going to send a First Class label for 11 ounces to ship them back in. If you can't pack any better than that you shouldn't be shipping comics and buyers shouldn't be out any expense because you took shortcuts.

Returned and refunded. 13 days to get here Media Mail. 2 days to get back First Class.

You think he was in a hurry to get back his damaged book?

I wasn't about to take a Media Mail shipment to the Post Office, then have to wait as much as another two weeks for them to get back before a refund could happen, much less run the risk of the package getting busted in transit if it even got accepted by my local Post Office which knows to check and then arrived Postage due there for full rate Parcel Post or returned back here with another delay.

Media Mail for comics is committing MAIL FRAUD. Because you got away with violating the postal regulations yesterday or even a thousand times does not mean you will not get the next one busted and is still a crime. I've had long discussions with the managers here that are working to get reports submitted on trying removing Media Mail as an option entirely since it's abused so much costing the Post Office millions in lost revenue per year from the crooks abusing the system since only the extreme cases will end up getting prosecuted in a court as a last resort since it costs about $26,000 to try the case according to the head guy. They use other means as a first option which can include outright barring of the shipper from being able to use the service at all. With enough cases it's also possible for racketeering charges to be added from what I've read. Beyond all that, it's just simply and unquestionably WRONG!!!!

Honest, legitimate businesses should not have to be competing with criminals violating the rules to gain an unfair business advantage.

In addition to being against the law and incredibly slow shipping times, you're dealing with collectibles that are easily damaged and the inspection process, even if the items do not get busted and returned to sender, can be damaged anywhere from the inspection point to the destination. I personally had one box so bad it had comics hanging out the side when it arrived!!!!! Who knows how many comics got lost in transit falling out the box entirely.

The only responsible choice is to continue to report sellers using the method directly to the Post Office locally and over the phone and continue to hand out copies of the regulations to the Post Offices you visit so new Postal Employees become aware and start enforcing the rules!!!!

We're also working to develop a specific new shipping option just for print that has advertising like comics so there will be additional choices in the future that are slower than first Class or Priority but Cheaper and LEGAL!! In the mean time continue to report those breaking the law and sites that allow open advertising of the option to do so like this one.


https://about.usps.com/notices/not121/not121_tech.htm

Please show me a situation where someone was charged and prosecuted in a court of law for sending items Media Mail. I'd be very interested to see that. If it's something you can be fined and sent to jail for, I guess that makes ebay culpable in some way by even allowing comics to be shipped Media Mail. With all their tech, it would be very easy to prohibit that shipping rate as an option for comic sales.

No, no it is not Mail Fraud.
"A scheme to defraud means depriving someone of property by deceitful or dishonest means."


I'm sure they enjoyed those discussions immensely.


Good luck with that.


Pfft, I have Media Mail shipments show up in 2-3 days almost every single time.


While you're at it, might as well charge the carrier that delivers the "illegal" package with Distribution and pick up the clerks who send the "contraband" with Aiding and Abetting.


I am 1,000% in favor of this. No joke, I would love to see this happen.


This is a patently false statement. In essence what they are saying is that all comic have ads in them. FALSE. Maybe most comics but certainly not all contain advertising.

Short list:

Marvel Fanfare
Classics Illustrated
Cerebus
Marvel Age
EVERY SINGLE TRADE PAPERBACK AND GRAPHIC NOVEL
so many more that I can't possibly remember them all

Not to mention reprint comics like the Marvel Milestone's that reprint ads from decades before. Does that still count as an ad?

"Not again" is a good title for this thread.

You're cracking me up, Howie!

Seriously, can you imagine the public's response if some DA in a city somewhere laid down the full force of the prosecutor's office on a large racketeering charge for.....people shipping items Media Mail? Talk about having priorities screwed up.

Well ... I know for a fact that comics are used in classrooms all over the place. In fact, I took a course in college myself that required multiple volumes of Love and Rockets. So ... comics CAN BE educational material.

Well....technically....there are some Marvel trades from the early 2000s that have some ads in the back for stuff other than just other books.



I recall that they had disclaimers on every ad page: "Facsimile Advertisement - No Longer Valid."

Yeah, the only site that I've seen that suggests that misusing Media Mail is mail fraud is Pitney Bowes. All the information that I've seen from USPS simply states that mailing items that do not qualify is against postal standards and may be subject to paying the full rate.



I can just picture him being driven down the highway filming the licence plates of everybody who was speeding, then going to the police station and demanding that all violators be sentenced to 5 years in prison for speeding, reckless endangerment, and......what the heck unauthorized use of a vehicle (typically used for joyriding, but what the heck - speeding is an unauthorized use as well).



I'm not sure if the criteria has been updated, but ads over 10 years old used to be exempt from the Media Mail standards as well. Funny that the blanket rule by USPS to restrict ALL comics isn't even in accordance to their own stated guidelines in many cases. I suppose it would be somewhat difficult to train people how to look through comics for ads and printing dates without damaging the merchandise, however (if you've been to the Post Office and seen some of the people they hire nowadays, you would understand this to be true).

Funny thing to me is people who believe that Postal employees treat Media Mail packages poorly and Priority packages are handled with kid gloves.

When I drop off orders at the Post Office, no matter what classification they are, the counter people toss them over their shoulder into the bin without even looking. Doesn't matter what it is or if it has "Fragile", "Do Not Bend", "Handle With Care" or whatever else stamped all over it the box gets haphazardly chucked into a container 5-6 feet away then gets piled on with the rest of the packages. That's just the behavior that I have witnessed, who knows what happens behind the scenes.

I've had Priority mail delivered to me that has been folded in half and crammed in my mailbox or left sitting on the front porch in the middle of torrential rain even though the side porch, which has a roof and is dryer, is only two or three steps away. Couple weeks ago I got a Priority Mail Envelope with comics in it that had been ripped open at some point and the comics were spilling out of it. PRIORITY, not Media.

So stop with all the nonsense about Priority being handled better than Media. They treat it all like junk. It's how YOU package it that matters not how you assume that there's a difference.

You are correct, Howie. I always add insurance at my cost to orders over $75. I've had to file damage claims three or four times since I've started selling. Every time it has been for Priority packages. Never Media Mail.

Also, when you consider I'd say a good 95%+ of my buyers choose Media Mail, then that damage rate for Priority seems to be incredibly high. I get more nervous about damages when I ship Priority than I do Media.

As a postal carrier, I can tell you that I have never heard of any employee that handles mail differently (other than prioritizing what gets delivered on any given day) based on what class of mail it is.





I know! Those Flat Rate Boxes aren't very sturdy, especially the squarish ones. The only Flat Rate Boxes that I use anymore are the rectangular ones.

As someone that has worked for USPS for over 30 years, I can't tell you guys how many times I have heard the clerks, carriers and/or management commiserating and/or outright laughing about THAT ONE customer!

Postal management's time is packed with conference calls, filling out performance reports, making sure all of the routes have been covered and that the clerks aren't spending too much time on each customer, etc. So much so that many don't even have enough time to see to it that their carriers actually have the necessary equipment that they need to do their jobs. By my own experience over the course of several managers that we have had over the past few years (which we tend to go through like underwear), one would think that making sure that the bathrooms were stocked with soap and paper towels was the most difficult task on the planet! That's just one example of something simple that postal management can't seem to find the time to take care of because so much of their time is in meetings and filling out reports!

When one Googles "How to handle difficult customers", three of the top suggestions are: Listen, empathize, and build rapport. It's hard for me to imagine that any local manager is going to have any affect on the national policy of the USPS. My guess is that the guy is just being indulgent so that he can get on with his day.

Something else I was thinking about regarding this is, How much money is USPS actually "losing" due to Media Mail? Can you even quantify it? Whenever I see the Postmaster General dragged before Congress every few years to answer why his agency is losing money, I never once have heard him (or anyone else) say, "well, if we can just get a handle on those darn comic collectors sending their comics Media Mail, then we could finally turn a profit!"

Along with that, I find it humorous that I can send comics to other comic dealers with names like "Joe's Comics" plastered on the address line and they STILL aren't inspected. It just isn't worth their time to check and inspect.

My store sends books Media Mail, with the name of the store plastered on the label (including the word COMICS) and usually in Diamond comic boxes.

We've only had ONE issue where the receiving post office actually had an issue with it being Media Mail. In 20+ years of shipping comics through the mail.

You know what I do?
I do a large purchase of 60pt clear plastic boards from ComicPro Line, which usually costs me about $1.28 or per board after figuring in tax/shipping) and I add it to the price of every book I sell. I used to use 80pt boards but they stopped making them, not to mention using discount shipping label services like pirateship (or ebay depending on what is cheaper) and send ANY book (regardless of value) bagged and boarded with them.

It doesn't always mean I am the cheapest book in town, but I guar-an-f`n-T that book is rock `fn solid.. and you wont see crush damage like that on my books... (unless I got them like that to begin with :p )

And considering the number of people I've had literally use cut-up cereal boxes to "protect" books lately.. it reassures me im still doing the right thing.

Even better (of course this happens right after my last order) they are now offering free shipping which is huge considering a case (ten 5-packs or 50 boards) is like 12 pounds for 6" 7/8th x 10.5" "current/modern" sized boards.. they're expensive. But worth every penny.